The: WHAT SHOULD I EAT THREAD

Bicycle related chatter & discussion
timyone
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Postby timyone » 14 May 2011, 11:01

Ok people, heres a thread for posting every thing you have found on the net, or know about what to eat before or after riding, or in between to stop cramps, improve performance and recovery, or just lose weight?

What do you know about protein powders, Creatine, Magnesium tablets, or any thing else. I know we have some Dieticians in the club that may be able to help with any doubt about the latest fads etc.

timyone
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Postby timyone » 14 May 2011, 11:07

Ok, the only really well researched rumour i know about food is what to do right after a ride. I learnt this off a rider i used to ride with who was being coached by a lad who was giving nutrician talks to the AIS, as well as coaching a rider who has since gone pro etc.

After riding for the first 10 mins or so your body is converting carbs to muscle glycogen at an increased rate, so a greater extent of sugars etc can be taken in to improve recovery for the next ride, and it not likely to be converted to fat etc. for the next hour or so you can move onto high carb foods such as pasta etc, this will all improve your chances of being able to double over your training well that night or the next morning. The add on to this was that they reckoned you should also have some protein powder in amongst it all, depending perhaps a bit on what youve done. But this could help with the 12 or so weekly training sessions.

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 15 May 2011, 15:52

This post my friend done on fructose is interesting


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Postby AlexD » 15 May 2011, 20:06

I think that fructose article highlights what my grandparents always said - the further the food gets from the farm, ie: the more processed and refined it is, the worse it is for you. High Fructose Corn Syrup doesn't just occur naturally.

Lately I've been a fan of kangaroo steak/mince. Heaps of protein, not much fat, cheap as chips, and there's too many roos anyway so you're helping the farmers out by eating them. The "gamey" flavour can be great if it's cooked in the right ways.

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T-Bone
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Postby T-Bone » 15 May 2011, 20:56

I'm a fan of the Kangaroo Meat as well, just don't overcook the steak. The mince is usually cheaper, tastier and healthier than the alternatives, and it's great in a pasta sauce. Though i did see some silly ad last night trying to tell me it was bad (authorised by the kangaroo protection society or something...)

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Postby patn » 16 May 2011, 10:26

Specifically on post-workout nutrition; Ive never done reading on this for endurance athletes, so I don't think I can comment too much on that. Tim-everything I've ever read agrees with the stuff you're saying, although perhaps a slightly different emphasis. ALL top power athletes take protein supplements after training. Things like 100% standing starts or heavy deadlifting tear muscle fibres left right and centre, and protein supplements are needed straight away for repair. I guess thats a bit different to endurance events where muscles become totally depleted and need to be replenished, but don't sustain too much damage to the muscle fibres themselves. Taking high GI foods immediately after workouts is usually called insulin spiking. From my reading the idea is that insulin converts + transports glucose in the blood to muscles, but in the process other goodies like creatine, amino acids, protein etc are taken as well.

So protein is required to repair damaged muscles, and spiking insulin encourages the body to quickly take necesarry goodies to muscles. Out of interest, a friend who is the NSW bodybuilding champion starts drinking a high GI drink as he nears the end of a heavy session, eats an apple immediately after finishing (so combined gives himself a big insulin spike), then has his hit of protein.

PS I love kangaroo at restaurants, but I just can't seem to cook it right when I do it. Someone told me that its like chicken (+unlike beef) in that it has to be cooked through to be safe to eat, but when I do that its so tough its like eating a shoe. Is that true? Can I eat kangaroo rare?

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 16 May 2011, 10:44

I'd be a bit cautious of eating Kangaroo rare, its a game meat. Do some research on the internet on that.

Those of you who are interested in reducing your fat levels, I suggest you do some research on post workout nutrition. The body will need to replenish the glycogen burnt during the exercise and its easier to replenish that from digesting sugar than it is to convert fat cells, so you need to get the nutrition right.

I'm about to cut some of the protein we brought the other week with some carbs. I was wondering what carbs and % each of us is going to use?

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Postby patn » 16 May 2011, 11:43

Mike - thats an interesting point regarding insulin spiking and weight loss.

The idea is that the glucose that caused the insulin spike is not taken to replenish muscles whose energy stores have been depleted. Rather, it is a very short-term method used only to encourage the rapid uptake of nutrients into damaged muscles. Instead, your long-term (i.e. daily) nutrition + eating plan should be such that your body fat % is kept down. Obviously if you drink 2 litres of coke after a session thats more sugar than is necessary. Instead, my friend uses an apple to do it. I don't know a precise amount, but I think we have an idea of the correct order of magnitude...

I hear people talking alot about the exact amount of supplements (e.g. protein) to take, and whether it should be different e.g. for a match sprinter as opposed to a pursuit rider. Certainly the more damage to muscles you do the more protein you need, but I think these details are perhaps a little unnecessary for us... I suspect the best thing to do with supplements is to always take them as advised on the pack...

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 16 May 2011, 13:45

Great info patn, you certainly know your stuff. I didn't know that an apple (or two) would of been sufficient. There is so much to learn about sugar.

Most of my protein comes from the food I eat, however I do use some protein supplement, in particular breakfast at work. What I am unclear about is the digestion of the protein, I understand that some carbs are required to aid in digestion, but I am unclear as to how much.

As you have said, how much protein we need is dependent on what we are doing with our muscles and also how much muscle you have. There's a paper on AIS about this which would interest some, when I get a chance, I'll fish it out.

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Karzie
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Postby Karzie » 16 May 2011, 16:32


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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 17 May 2011, 12:21

I feel that if I improved my diet that my performance would also improve

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Michael
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Postby Michael » 17 May 2011, 14:19

…wait a minute!!
Are you guys saying the macchiato and muffin back at the coffee shop on Saturday morning is NOT scientifically balanced for optimum recovery?

timyone
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Postby timyone » 17 May 2011, 15:03

I'd say skim milk is good after rides, it has higher carbs minus the fat, so I get a large cap. The muffin I'm unsure about, a banana smoothies could be the best option, it has potassium too. I get skim banana smoothies, yoghurt instead of ice cream, if I can afford it and it was a bigish ride for me. Just under this would be skim chocolate milkshake

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 17 May 2011, 15:08

After I get home from the cafe, I usually have some eggs

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Postby orphic » 17 May 2011, 15:25

Beer and pizza is also really good... And riding your bike lots! So you basically eat some pizza, drink some beer, and then go for a ride. If you want to do anything beyond that to get faster you might have to find some spanish meat to put on your pizza.

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Postby Lizanne » 17 May 2011, 15:35

i'm with you on the beer and pizza diet, but you forgot brownies. you can't forget a nice warm brownie with icecream.

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Postby orphic » 17 May 2011, 16:13

Well, if you're Lizanne it's the beer, pizza, brownie and caramel slice diet. The brownies and caramel slices are really important for repairing muscle fibres after you smash it up Easter Suburbs hills on an 80 inch gear.

Seriously, I'm trying to eat healthy this week... Trying. Milky Ways and Mint Patties don't count, right? What about Oreos?

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Postby kevinllewellyn » 17 May 2011, 16:54

Pumkin soup and potato soup are very nice

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Michael
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Postby Michael » 18 May 2011, 12:43


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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 18 May 2011, 12:49

Hey Patn, I've read comments that use the term "Hormonal responses" Have you come upon this and what's your take on it?

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Postby rhys » 18 May 2011, 22:06

To stop cramping, I stretch of a night time and drink heaps of water, whenever I can. If I am going for a long and/or torturous ride, a few days before I will start drinking lots of mixed up Endura. This is great for warding off cramps.

As far as losing weight, I'm not too sure because I've always been pretty heavy. I've lost about 10kg this year by only drinking light beer, and about a quarter of the time I would normally drink beer. Riding lots also helps. I find that for my kind of body shape, weights and high-intensity workouts like riding my BMX at the skatepark for a few hours really trims me up quickly.

I think the willpower to eat what you know is right is the problem for most people. Unfortunately, the best food is not always the easiest to come by when you are hungry.

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 18 May 2011, 22:35

I too drink heaps of water as I sweat a hell of a lot in my RPM (spin) classes. And that brings up the question, how do I know if I've got a salt deficiency?

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Postby patn » 19 May 2011, 08:54

Hi Mike,

I haven't heard that phrase before, but since insulin is a hormone I guess it makes sense.

On your post Rhys - I did the Coota race a few weeks ago, which is my first longer ride (long for me anyway) and I got smashed by cramps at ~65km mark!! They were terrible!! My left leg literally got stuck at 90 degrees and I had to get off the bike and straighten it with my arms hehehe :) In a race of that length (90-120mins say), how much do you guys drink? What do you eat while riding? How do I avoid having that happening again!?!

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Postby kiwiames » 19 May 2011, 09:18

Well i didnt eat anything during the coota races, i had 1 bottle of plain water and another of electronlite mix, but neither bottle was empty at the end. If the weather was hotter maybe i would have drank both bottles. touch wood ive never suffered cramping during riding - if im ever going to cramp it allways happens in the calves at 3am. not a nice way to wake up. having said that, i havent cramped at any time now for quite a while so i suspect my food and fluid intake is sufficent.

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 19 May 2011, 19:32

When racing I have an energy gel about every 45 minutes + electrolyte in my water. But once I'm out of the running, I stop taking them.

For training I usually eat nothing before and take nothing for up to 150mins, such as a ride to Waterfall, but if I enter RNP I will have something. This figure will depend on the individual and in particular how much glycogen you body stores in you muscles and liver.

Water consumption varies with the conditions. Generally you want to drink before you are thirsty.

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Postby orphic » 19 May 2011, 21:10


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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 19 May 2011, 21:19


patn
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Postby patn » 20 May 2011, 13:30

awww but waterfall is so far away and my arse will get so sore :(

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Postby orphic » 20 May 2011, 14:22

Hehehe, Waterfall is not very far at all. Suck in up Princess, your arse needs to adapt ;)

timyone
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Postby timyone » 20 May 2011, 15:26


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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 26 May 2011, 15:19

Latest article from my friend



Enjoy

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 28 May 2011, 21:12


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Stuart
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Postby Stuart » 02 Jun 2011, 11:16

Sandwiches are good. I love this bit "It even has a history in the sport's most renowned races: In the 15th stage of the 1975 Tour de France, Aussie domestique Don Allan abruptly dismounted his bike and refused to continue without a 25-tooth gear, a beer, and a chicken sandwich. The team mechanic had only a 24, but the crowd pulled through with a glass of wine and the sandwich. Satisfied, Allan finished the stage."

http://www.bicycling.com/training-nutri ... Sandwiches

AliG
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Postby AliG » 30 Jun 2011, 21:45

David Zabriskie's gone almost vegan.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... #printMode

(okay, clearly I should have figured out how to post a link before this...)

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Postby Julio » 30 Jun 2011, 22:31


orphic
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Postby orphic » 30 Jun 2011, 23:13

Sounds like you have your nutriton and hydration strategy dialled Julian. Top stuff!

For the 24hr I used shotz (electrolyte tabs that are sugar free), torq bars and hammer gels. I planned to drink 3/4 of a bottle of water with 1 shotz tab disolved in it every hour, and had an alarm set to go off on my Garmin every half hour. I would alternate between half and Torq bar and a Gel each time the alarm went off - so I was basically taking in about 200 calories per hour. Sometimes I would eat a Sandwhich instead of the bar. Seemed to work really well for me and I never felt too full or like my stomach was empty. Hydration also worked really well. I think I got kind of lucky really, no stomach issues... That amount of time riding on bars and gels people usually get massive problems.

I also pre-loaded with magnesium tabs for the two weeks before hand. And hydrated like nothing else in the days leading up to it.

But yeah, wouldn't even think about doing all of the above for an event less than 4 hours! I wouldn't even be as concerned for an 8 hour now.

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 30 Jun 2011, 23:25


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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 01 Jul 2011, 09:13

Nah, I'm chicken

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T-Bone
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Postby T-Bone » 01 Jul 2011, 17:23


AliG
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Postby AliG » 01 Jul 2011, 19:52

Nope. That must have been an overload of meat at fault - he's only changed his diet recently.

timyone
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Postby timyone » 30 Aug 2011, 10:33

http://www.cyclenation.com.au/Blogs/Blo ... &eid=49480

how many carbs should we eat for cycling?
This blog talks a bit about how much to eat for a race in carbs

Bellow there is also a rap up of the Geellong tour by Sam Rutherford!

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mikesbytes
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Postby mikesbytes » 07 Oct 2011, 16:51


timyone
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Postby timyone » 07 Oct 2011, 17:51

Oooo interesting

timyone
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Postby timyone » 31 Mar 2012, 19:24

http://www.badwater.com/training/bornmeal.html

good article on what to eat before a race, you just have to ignore the advertising etc


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